Messages in ICG #boardofdirectors (Slack) <2019-10-06 2019-10-10>
2019-10-09
Elaine 12:44 PM
Immediately and until further notice, @Betsy R. Marks is the voting
representative for SiliconWeb chapter.
Betsy
R. Marks 1:44
PM
There is no requirement for--or even mention of--an annual audit in any of our
documents, because Marty Gear and the other founders went out of their way to
ensure that our structure would not trigger such a thing with the IRS. It's
part of why membership dues were so low to begin with.
Please
remember that the GCFCG, and subsequently CGW and Sick Pups chapters were all
founded on the idea that sharing information was paramount to our purpose, and
that until CC3 the GCFCG was largely a shell organization devoted to sponsoring
Costume-Con.
Betsy
R. Marks 2:34
PM
Furthermore, there's this advice: https://www.nonprofitissues.com/to-the-point/501c3-required-have-external-audit
We
file a Form 990-N which indicates income below $50k total, far below the dollar
amounts that would traditionally trigger an audit.
In
fact, according to the last document of record (from 2014), we had under $20k
TOTAL in our bank account.
I'm
awaiting confirmation of the total dollar amounts we're receiving currently for
our members, annually, but based on preliminary numbers and assuming everyone
renews and nobody leaves or joins, we make less than $3k per year on
memberships.
We
have received infusions of cash as donations from estates, but those are
relatively rare.
Based
on my experience working with the Puppet Co, which had an audit every year
because of income well in excess of $500k annually, the cost each year was
something on the order of $2k. (edited)
Furthermore,
there is a space on the Form 990 for reporting an audit. Being audited will
likely raise more flags than it will avoid, which is exactly what Marty strove
to avoid by setting up the 501(c)(3) in the first place.
Betsy
R. Marks 3:12
PM
And as Jeanine has pointed out to me, $2 of every membership goes to the
Archives annually, which cuts the total available for paying for an audit by
approximately 25-50%.
Meanwhile,
there has been plenty of talk regarding the five year plan, but I don't recall
a vote to adopt the plan, merely the presentation of it, which was shortened
due to time constraints because of the meeting.
In
the lapse between my taking office in May and now, did our chapter miss a vote
to adopt this plan and move forward with it as presented?
Thanks
for clarifying.
Jeanine
Swick 3:36
PM
there has been no discussion of it.
[19 replies Last reply 2019-10-10 5:44 PM]
Mera Rose 2 years ago
That’s partially the point. Here we are again at budget time, and
the 5 year plan and all of it’s information was intended to spark discussion on
ALL of these things: the guidelines, the financials, membership and
chapter drives, restructuring committees, updating archives, and creating a
dynamic website.
We wanted EVERYONE’S input on where the
organization should focus its attention, and how to address the concerns of
diminishing membership and provide more benefits to our members and to the
costuming community. We introduced the 5 year plan in the hopes that
everyone would talk about it on the forums for the next year and come up with
proposals and ideas and get involved.
We have been met with hostility and outright
rage from the same individuals at every attempt to have a
conversation. It keeps the conversation from
occurring. This is not a failure of communication technology, it is
a failure of communication efficiency. We should be discussing the
things that are concerns for the organization and it’s members instead of
rehashing grudges and issues that should be left in the past so that we can
move on with a vision for the ICG’s future that continues the legacy of
community, archiving, costuming excellence, and fairness that the organization
is known for.
We are now at budget time again, looking at
spending monies on the same maintenance items for the organization instead of
looking at how those funds could be utilized to help the organization
grow.
Where does this organization and its membership
want to go? That’s the question. And on the way to where
we are going (or, where we are stagnating if no one wants any of these
proposals or wants to suggest any others) we need to protect the organization
and it’s future by ensuring that our governing documents and financial
documents are up to current standards and best practices and include financial
solvency and transparency.
Why is this a problem? Why should
these conversations not occur?
BTW, it’s a little disingenuous to say that
Marianne and I are being unreasonable or attacking or blackballing or
stonewalling when, in fact, we have never attempted to silence anyone’s
opinion, and have taken every opportunity to hear every opinion including
moving the guidelines back to committee to discuss them further.
Moreover, we have not silenced anyone’s voices
by removing their access to any group on Slack or Yahoo to ensure that EVERYONE
can participate. Blackballing or stonewalling would require that we
take that form of action. Nothing that has been approached has been
an attack, though I can understand where someone may have taken our attempts to
discuss change as an attack. Change is hard. We get that.
As for “retaliation”, I have NO idea how
requesting an audit could be retaliatory towards Silicon Web. There
hasn’t been much discussion in that group for at least 2 weeks as far as I’ve
seen and I’m not certain that a discussion about changing communication methods
would spark some form of retaliation? If silicon web wants to revert
to carrier pigeons, I would be concerned as it’s the web based chapter, but
I’ll go with it... my barn cats might eat the pigeons but that’s their
nature, not retaliation, I promise. I am thrilled that there are 3
new chapters working on forming here in VA and look forward to being involved
with them as well, so if Silicon Web needs me to go away then I can do that if
it suits their leadership. I am NOT a fan of confrontation and am
frankly horrified and aghast at how many of these communications quickly become
confrontational. I’m thrilled that this is not occurring in the
guidelines committee and wish that was the case for the BoD. It’s
exhausting living it, so I can only imagine how exhausting it must be to read
it for those who have not chosen to engage in these threads.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
I hope you have a good evening... I’ve got spreadsheets to create
and data to parse. Thanks for posting all the financial info to
Yahoo Jeanine! It will be very helpful in seeing where the trends
are... Oh, btw, I’m offline until Monday when I head to bed this
evening (probably within the next hour or so). I’m not ignoring
anyone, I’m just enjoying my 19th anniversary with my hubby with my family.
Also sent to the channel
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
To get EVERYONE in on the discussion it need to be presented in its entirety in
the newsletter and the Yahoo ICG general discussion list (of which not ICG
members are on) in an open forum so all can participate. Both of which has not
happened. So you need to come up with a way to get it to the entire membership.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
I was under the impression it was being put on the website and posted to both
lists once it was up. I provided a copy to Ann on her Zip drive at
CostumeCon so that could happen. I did not realize it had
not? It is on the website, was it never posted to the groups that it
was available? I have issues with yahoo and do not always get the
emails...
Mera Rose 2 years ago
It’s been on Slack since July 3
Image from iOS
\
Also sent to the channel
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
Not everyone is on Slack or do some want to be. So this is not the
best option at this time. We have more than one member with little
or no internet available.
Jacalyn Boggs 2 years ago
It is in Slack. I’m assuming that our secretary, who put this on slack, also
put it on yahoogroups (which I once more cannot log in to). What BOD
member is still not in slack and I would postulate that servicing a BOD member
with little or no internet available is not going to be functional on any
internet platform. Unless we are going to begin having regular
teleconferences that said member can access, then no solution will
work. However, we have voted to move to Slack and so we need to just
live with that and stop harping on some belief that someone is not here. Even
Byron is here, despite his making it clear he did not want to be and abstaining
from the vote. Heck, he’s been nothing but polite and accepting of the vote he
abstained from in this regard than others. Honestly, the constant
harping on a voted on move is not helping get anything done and has grown
wearing. If you want to find some new forum for us to test out,
submit it to the tech committee. But, until such time as a different
method of communication is found, we have slack.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
This discussion for the 5 year plan needs to involve the ENTIRE ICG Membership
not just the BoD as it was presented at the general meeting. It is our general
membership we are supposed to be serving. Many of them had questions that did
not get answered as the presentation took way too long and many did not get to
speak or were overlooked.
Jacalyn Boggs 2 years ago
In a quick search on Slack, I found that Betsy put the 5 year plan in the general
(open to all members) channel for people to comment on. So not only
has this been available for discussion, it's been available to the entire
membership. Betsy had one comment listed in the file about the mission
statement that was a fair conversation point. If you haven't seen it, I
recommend you check it out now. It would be something at least worth
discussing.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
People need to be poked to get any feed back. This is a hobby not someone's
main focus in life.
Jacalyn Boggs 2 years ago
Meanwhile, I have PDF files that I posted to Slack, on July 3rd. So you can
either go comment on Betsy's Google Drive, or you can view the pDF in slack
natively and join a threaded discussion on any of these posts. At any rate,
there's multiple copies in multiple formats here in Slack for the GENERAL
membership to view and discuss.
Merrily 2 years ago
Can the 5 year plan be posted with the newsletter on the website so every
member has access? Can it be presented in a way which is asking for input
rather than a final solution? The current 5-year plan looks like it had been
discussed by the BoD and voted on. Membership needs to know this is not the
case and their input is valued.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
I would LOVE it if this could happen!!!
Mera Rose 2 years ago
It is on the website in the general meeting minutes area but if we can
circulate it EVERYWHERE that would be great!
Jacalyn Boggs 2 years ago
The 5 year plan presentation is on the website. It’s in Slack. And I believe,
for those who can still get logged in to yahoo groups, it might be on yahoo.
That’s every method of access possible short of showing up on someone’s
doorstep with a computer screen to show it on. Hopefully this helps!
There’s some good information in the five year plan and I definitely would like
to see some of the movement forward found in it. It was a lot to process at the
general meeting, but after having reviewed it several times since we got the
presentation this summer and some discussions with people trying to expand
knowledge about the guild, I am excited to be looking forward. This guild has
the potential to offer so much to people, we just have to be open to new people
and new ideas.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
Guess what I still can't find your files here on Slack.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
Go to #general and put the cursor in the search box at the top, then
put “5 year plan” in the box. It should come back with this:
Image from iOS
Mera Rose 2 years ago
I also sent it to you from Jacqueline’s 2nd file upload on that list (as that
is the full and accurate presentation) in a direct message.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
I happened to have downloaded it previously from the files. After
you wade through a bunch of other non relevant stuff someone will find it.
Personal photos need be kept seperate from the official business files.
Marianne
Pease 5:47
PM
The BoD tends to be light on discussion, and heavy on reactionary comments more
than anything. Mentions of modernizing how we track membership
becomes a falderal about needing lawyers and changing the Bylaws, and a
tangental mention that the IRS has looked more closely at small 501c3s in recent
years, and that we should make sure we have our house in order is somehow
interpreted as an attack somehow? Furthermore, as a corporation it is our
responsibility to be responsible stewards for the organization. Our goal
shouldn't be "avoiding" the IRS but serving the ICG to the best of
our ability.
Betsy
R. Marks 5:57
PM
If there's a question of our house being in order, asking questions is a great
way to discover and resolve those issues, determining how to approach the
questions should be a group effort. Dropping a major plan and assuming 20
distinct organizations will simply go along with the plan sans discussion is,
in my opinion as a chapter president and founding officer is a problem.
This
forum should be discussing the issues yuh ou see as problems and working out a
solution based on an agreement that what you see as problems are the same thing
other chapters also see.
My
contention is that we are still suffering from a communication problem, and
until we solve that to every chapter's satisfaction, we won't get past this.
You
are welcome to disagree with both my concerns and approach,
[4 replies Last reply 2019-10-10 5:17 PM]
Mera Rose 2 years ago
Please see my comment on Jeanine’s thread copied to the main thread.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
We’ve asked questions, Betsy, and we have talked to a lot of people, you
included. And we have tried to spark a conversation to discuss these
things with people who have not spoken up yet too. If the response
is to immediately become confrontational then no one else will want to
participate.“I like chocolate ice cream. Do you?” “STRAWBERRY
IS THE BEST! No other ice cream will do! We can’t have
chocolate because it must be strawberry and the last time we went out for ice
cream people left because they didn’t like chocolate so we can NEVER do that
again! STRAWBERRY OR NOTHING!!!”And so people leave or don’t join
and those who want ice cream are stuck with strawberry whether they like it or
not.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
Somethingthat massive should have been broken down andposted by section and
someone taking point on it. Then provide a synopsis of the discussion points to
work on any revisions needed, before moving on to the next section.
Betsy R. Marks 2 years ago
Yes, exactly, Jeanine. Which, by the way, was what I was trying to communicate
back at Costume-Con. Dumping so much data, with an incomplete presentation, and
expecting everyone to either absorb the results or provide useful feedback was
extraordinary. The vast majority of the ICG's membership think of this
organization as a hobby (at best). If it held higher priority, the Treasurer
wouldn't have to fight every month for reports which should be provided monthly
because that's what our Standing Rules require.
You don't solve problems by shoving an entire
encyclopedia at a group this diverse and saying "Okay, let's vote!"
Furthermore, providing the material on the
ICG-BOD email list never happened until we said there was a problem, and
because fully one third of the Silicon Web's members weren't on board, there
was no way to present the information to them until that problem was fixed.
Feedback is possible if you put the content in
as many places as possible and provide the easiest methods for everyone to
reach them.
Assuming a level playground, especially when
half the country is still stuck on dial-up, is ludicrous.
Jeanine
Swick 6:01
PM
Ever think you threw way too much at one time? People do not like being
broadsided which is what is happening here? You want to know the big spender of
the budget? it is the archives and always has been. All the information will be
in multiple places.
by the way I just came back from helping a family who just lost everything in a
fire, including 2 pets.
[4 replies Last reply 2019-10-10 4:34 PM]
Mera Rose 2 years ago
I’m sorry for their loss. We just dealt with a fire as well (much
smaller, thankfully) so I completely understand how horrible it can be. I’m
glad you were there for them.
And yes, perhaps it was too much. We
wanted to put as much as we could out there to see what actually sparked
discussion and where the interest was. We thought it would be great
to have committees form and discuss and address these areas and that we could
all communicate for a year on it and then talk about it more next year and so
on and so on.
No one intended to broadside anyone. We
just want this organization that we are very passionate about to be active and
engaging and dynamic and involved. The costuming community is
booming and such a big thing this is a great time to capitalize on it for
growth.
And the archives should be our biggest budget
item. I’d love to see it doubled. I joined this
organization because of the archive because I believe it is so important to
create a visual archive of costuming art.
Also sent to the channel
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
If you want to see the archives budget doubled, you better have a plan to fund
it. The portion of the dues dedicated to the Archives does not cover
the yearly expenditures with out dipping into their savings account. Once that
is spent, every expenditure will have to be approved by the board to come out
of the general funds.
Mera Rose 2 years ago
Well, I do... lol. It’s in the part of the 5 year plan
presentation I didn’t get to present. Essentially, if we do
membership drives and streamline becoming members, joining chapters, and
creating chapters through updates to our website, then the additional dues
would effectively double that part of the budget.
Jeanine Swick 2 years ago
That is why it needs to be presented in sections. 35 minutes for that amount of
information that you knew wloud raise questions was very poor planning. Not to
mention the select committee of 2 who created it, there should have been more
people involved in the process. All this secretive work going on being done by
only 2 officers and no one else raises a lot of suspicion and you wonder why
there is resistance?
Betsy
R. Marks 6:35
PM
Two hour-long heated conversations by phone calls (which I received over the
last several weeks), containing threats and accusations along with warnings not
to divulge or otherwise communicate the details of said conversations doesn't
strike me as a nonconfrontational approach to anything.
I
am happy to discuss modernization and I really object to the implication that
by asking why these steps are suddenly necessary we are rejecting or refusing
change.
As
for being blackballed, it didn't escape the attention of several members that I
made a good offer to participate in the Guidelines committee, but I was passed
over without explanation. I trust Kevin's judgment completely, and haven't
pushed to be added to the committee, but that choice was pointed out to me by
several people who were surprised that I wasn't included in the group, which
now operates in a completely different private space from the one the ICG
already had.
And
with that, I will bid everyone a good night.
Regards,
Betsy
Mera
Rose 6:53
PM
Please ask them to present their questions any way that they can, by email, in
slack, or in yahoo groups. We are happy to discuss it and will cross
post questions and answers to make sure everyone is involved.
And
the presentation was slated for 35 minutes and was timed out
well. We should have just presented the entirety of it without
allowing questions during the presentation and then moved discussion to the
forums going forward as intended. There was no vote intended on this
presentation, it was simply a presentation to give ideas and get input.